Removal of external fixator in 43 Orthopedic surgery clinics in Germany

Waiting time was about 1.5 hours It was already borderline. I urgently sought an orthopedist because of a herniated disc. Unfortunately, the reality is this. Several people rejected me on the phone. I asked for an appointment by email. After about a week the answer came. You can come on November 23rd. After a few days, a lady called me and gave me an appointment to see the gentleman on November 17th due to the pain Kubosh. This doctor did everything right for me. He chose the right therapy for me. He took his time and explained every step. I am very satisfied with this clinic.

Badly organized. After waiting four months for an appointment for a stress fracture in the foot, it was postponed again two days beforehand. There was an alternative appointment at short notice, but I had to cancel it after waiting two hours. It was not possible to say how long I would have to stay in the waiting room and I had to go back to work. If it's already so long to find an appointment, I unfortunately don't understand why the waiting time on site is still so long. Conclusion: The clinic only seems suitable for people with an exceptional amount of time. It may be easier for private patients.

In March of this year, my wife received an artificial hip joint at the joint clinic. She was very well informed in advance by Professor Konstantinidis. She spent a total of 4 days in the clinic... Room top...food great.... Nursing staff very accommodating! The physiotherapist is great! Today she is fully mobile again and has no restrictions. This clinic can be recommended 100 percent.

The service in the " Station" is a disaster. Really really bad, the personal will barely visit or ask you if you need anything and moreover I have done their job, therefore being unable to have any meal as the baby was constantly crying...no one even asked if I need something... If I have to rate it - then I will even not put a star... just as bad as it is... No more here anymore!!! ( hopefully not reaching any hospital at all)!!!!

I’m not sure how well you think your clinic is working or how well you’re doing. However, our 6 month old has not eaten for 16 hours (3 of those hours are spend in your waiting room so far), or has eaten, but hasn’t managed to keep it inside as he has been puking, a lack of energy and a behavioral change after falling on his head. Now, like many parents, we seek the advice of a specialist. Where your clinic is unfortunately the closest one to us. We just wanted the advice of a doctor, however, we got shipped off the the emergency clinic by the receptionist. Here my issue starts. How can you call it an emergency clinic when the waiting time is over 3 hours? (3 hours and counting when writing this) When you don’t filter anyone coming in. I’m definitely not saying we’re an emergency case, neither am I stating I am a medical specialist and can judge the cases, but, from what I can see, 80% of the cases sitting in here aren’t emergency cases either. It’s just parents sitting and waiting. People sitting on the floor, people waiting outside in the rain or sitting in an idling car because you lack waiting room in an emergency clinic treated as an undersized doctors waiting room. From my point of view, this is only your issue: - either you’re understaffed in the children clinic and therefor decided to just sent everyone straight to this “emergency room”, even if it isn’t anything closely related to an emergency. Or; - you’re too small for the capabilities you’re trying to offer and hence investment is needed from your side to modernize and expand Or; - and this might be a bold one, you’re collecting insurance money by sending everyone to emergency care first and hope they get sent to the children’s clinic so you can bill twice. Which one is it?

I was there twice with my kids, the reception, emergency service were very friendly & helpful. One of kids were to stay in the hospital and the staff on the residing floor was also very helpful, my kid was also in the intensive care and we felt really in safe hands there with a super friendly and accommodating staff. A big thanks and kudos to all the team there!

I went for pain therapy/diagnosis. The final report differs from what was experienced. It lists therapies that I did not receive. After 16 days of stay, my treating doctor changed. I was taken in by an understanding doctor who also recognized the success of my own therapy. Another doctor wrote the final report, which is essential for my future medical career. The report praises the in-house therapy and downplays my personal successes against my illnesses. Now it's clear to me why you only get the report when you leave, i.e. at the door. Painkillers such as ibuprofen, which only numb the pain for a short time, are preferred here. I felt that the pain therapy was standardized. Individual deviations were not wanted. It was difficult or impossible to get used to multiple illnesses and alternative therapies here! The therapists were great. And it's pretty there too. However, there was a lack of opportunities to provide appropriate self-therapy in rooms and equipment (including outdoors). Ordering food was a disaster.

The clinic is very good, my surgery went well, I felt very good afterwards, I can recommend it and the nurses are all nice, just great

First the positive: The food is great, the kitchen team does a great job. For my birthday I received a birthday card from the kitchen team and a small, lovingly prepared fruit bowl. Thanks again for that. Ms. Noak, my physiotherapist in charge, is great, she explains the connections in a way that you can understand. She is sensitive and radiates calm. The nurses on ward 7 are trying very hard, but you can also sense some dissatisfaction, which I can understand. Now about my treatment. I am very disappointed about this, I would have liked more diagnostics, not just a gait analysis. My request for an MRI examination of the cervical and lumbar spine was rejected with the words: “We don’t see any need for that.” The CDs I had with me were already 2-3 years old, but were sufficient for the doctors who were responsible for me. The therapies I had were good to very good, but they mostly took place in the morning, so that you were knocked out by lunchtime. Sometimes you had to eat your breakfast within minutes. Stan had a lot on his agenda in the afternoon, but it was either watching videos about breathing therapy, which the group had already done in the morning, or using two devices in the hallway. So I went back home with tips and some rest, but with just as much pain as at the beginning. I think I was just unlucky with my doctors.

They don’t give an estimated waiting time for surgery- they kept pushing my surgery. I had to stay without eating any food or drinking any water for 24+ hours as they kept pushing my surgery. But overall the staff and doctors are very kind. They took care of me really well even though I didn’t speak German!

This place really deserves 0 stars. I’m sure there are hospitals in third world countries that have better service than this place. First of all, the Emergency Room receptionists don’t speak even basic English . Which is unbelievable being in a large international city with a high population of foreigners. They were basically unsympathetic and useless despite me being doubled over in pain. Where do I even begin with what I experienced here? I was admitted at 5am on Monday morning. The place was empty. Despite this, no one ever came to check on me for hours after putting in my IV and I woke up to it sucking my blood out. My toilet didn’t work which was a nightmare with constant vomiting and diarrhea . There was no toilet paper and despite me bringing this up to someone several times throughout the night it was never replaced. Because I had no way to flush the toilet or given any alternatives (even a trash can to vomit in would have been nice) I was forced to just keep stacking all my expulsions into the blocked toilet. For my second IV the nurses put it in wrong, no one noticed until the doctor came in hours later and saw it. I decided to discharge myself and when I left I saw all the nurses and support staff in the hallway chatting about their weekends and playing around on their phones. Absolutely despicable. Since this has been noted by several other reviewers, I believe there needs to be some firing of personnel and change of management. The room itself was also very unhygienic and reeked of urine and homelessness (similar to Hauptbahnhof) which made my already bad nausea even worse 🤮🤮🤢. The negligence at this hospital is out of this world and should be called out.

My sister had a serious operation in this hospital 4 days ago. After the operation, she spent the first night in the intensive care unit. My sister was very satisfied with the treatment in that department and felt calm. After transferring to the public sector, everyone is still very kind and helpful. Very clean hospital, with professional and lovely staff. And also the atmosphere is beautiful.

I, or we, would like to thank the doctors and nurses who looked after and cared for our father and husband from the bottom of our hearts. The situation wasn't easy for us, but everyone always answered our questions openly and honestly, even if they asked the question 20 times. They stood by our side in his and our most difficult hour. The ITS2 is not a ward like any other, but people with heart work there ❤️. Thank you thank you thank you

They are really unfiendly. I am learning German because I live here but my german is not sufficient enough to book medical appointment. If you can't understand me that is okay but you don't have to be rude!

Nurses are kind, the place is clean. You must speak german at least on a minimum level and understand what they say to use the services.

I had a great experience giving birth at UKE. everyone working there was super nice, cooperative and friendly at the registration and at the Kreißaal as well as in the postpartum care. We requested the family room, which became available in few hours post our request ( you do need to keep following up the availability status of the room til you get it though ) For the mom, you need to get a shirt/ dress to give birth in. And pjs for afterwards as well as the bathing supplies For the baby, you will only need to have the go home outfit and maybe a pacifier. All else will be supplied by the hospital. The meals served are really good too. Not the typical tasteless hospital food .. you will need to have some snacks with you for in between the meals especially if you’re planning on breastfeeding. All in all, i had a really good experience and highly recommend the hospital

Waste of time! I got food posioned and waited for hours! Nobody checked me and I had to leave because another patient came and told us she was waiting for 7 hours. I mean this is an emergency, it shouldn't be like that. Aside from all these stuff there was very rude. I was fighting with pain and with the people at the same time. Not even talking about the money I paid for the taxi because I thought I can get help here. I don't know what I am gonna do if I ever have more risky situations like that. This has to be changed.

18 year old friend of mine has been hospitalized due to a tumor. because of a so called "emergency" a vacation had to be cancelled and he didn't even make it into the infirmary. during the operation they managed to injure the liver (which isn't exactly spottet on the head) and he was in a critical state. he died less than a week after the operation and the doctors had the audacity to say "have a nice evening". worst hospital ever. will make sure none of my loved one's ever go there again.

Very bad hospitality.

My girlfriend went to their E.R. It took them seven hours to accommodate us. A nurse misplaced her chart adding to the delay. I understand that there is a triage system that prioritizes severe or emergency cases but waiting for the whole day is absurd. It was especially hard for us, since we are foreigners and cannot speak fluent German. Honestly, it was a horrible experience.

Super...

My worst experience in a hospital for far. My room is beside a place that are remodeling, 12 hours of the sound of a hammer constantly. Due my operation I can not eat solids, so the only thing they are offering me is pocket soup, no veggies no fruits, nothing. And forget about to find the manager, she is never in the office, and she will never pick up the phone. The personal in my station are good the most of them, the problem in hospital is systematic.

The most irresponsible and unprofessional team I've ever met. My oparation was cancelled one day before the last minute, after all the preparation. Even worse, for more than one month, no apologize, no explaination and no call back to arrange a new time for the oparation.

Worst hospital I have ever been too. They are under staffed and under funded and care more about making money then care of patients. Cancelled appointments without letting patients know due to broken equipment and staff shortages. You would get batter care in a third world country hospital. Asklepios is a shinning example of how broken the German Medical System is.

The worst experience with the treatment for an international patient. The hospital arranged for us viewing for a cardiology patient. We travelled from a far away to be there (having paid a huge lump some that was supposed to be used for the tests etc). Instead - the person who took blood tests did not even wear PPE, the doctor who saw us had not even read our history (having sent if a month before), did not do any meaningful tests that would bring us to the diagnosis, still waiting for the anamnesis (and prescriptions) to be sent to us after over two weeks.

Thank you so much to the orthopedics team and everyone at station M120. They gave me a new ACL after I tore it, the operation went perfectly, and the care I received after was outstanding. I prepared for the worst, but the friendliness and professionality of the staff made everything so, so much better.

The staffs are friendly, and they saved my friend, so 5 stars for sure. However, if it’s possible, I hope I’d never need to come here even they have a great view outside of the window. Stay healthy 🤲

Never go here, Please. Dr. Julia Brzoska promotes in Doctorlib reception of publicly insured patients, but they do not. They have unqualified personal on the front desk unaware fully of regulations. It wasted my time in such a delicate topic. They are another private clinic sustained by marketing.

Most Traumatizing Medical Experience Ever! While the Meo clinic might impress with its aesthetics and cordial staff, its administrative and financial aspects are deeply flawed: Lack of Transparency: I never received a clear financial breakdown for my treatments, and attempts to seek clarity were met with resistance. Billing Issues: A year post-treatment, I got bills escalated to collection agencies and court by PVS, an outsourced payment firm used by many of the clinic's doctors. The initial bills of approximately 3800 EUR more than doubled. Worse, the bills had incorrect patient details. Missing Medical Records: Despite continuous requests over two years, I've only gotten records from one out of the four doctors I saw. A recent visit revealed a mere two notes from 22 visits and a few prescription copies – no record of MRI/MRT scans, ultrasounds, cancer tests, or blood tests. Poor Communication: The clinic's staff claim that doctors operate autonomously and aren't answerable to them. The doctors, on the other hand, blame PVS, their invoice firm. PVS remains unresponsive, creating a maddening loop of non-accountability. Legal Issues: While withholding necessary medical documentation from me, the clinic keeps adding to my bills via lawyers. They know I need the documents for insurance, but continue to stonewall all communication attempts, even from my insurance provider. In summation, my experience with the Meo clinic has been nothing short of a nightmare. Despite promises of proficient service and clear English communication (given my expat status during the Covid lockdowns), I've received neither medical results nor proper documentation of treatments. Their blatant disregard and lack of support have left me feeling abused and overlooked. I warn potential patients, especially international and EU visitors to Germany, to be cautious before visiting this clinic! Expect zero documentation, no effective communication, and exorbitant bills. This clinic seems indifferent to the profound impacts such negligence might have on your life, expecting you to bear costs out-of-pocket despite insurance coverage. The only "documentation" you might get are bills from PVS that state amounts without any clear patient context. When reaching out to the clinic for help they clearly state that they aren’t responsible for any of “their doctors”… but at the same time advertise their clinic as a fully integrated medical institution that takes care of everything for you as their patent! It’s absolutely scandalous!

**EDIT TO RESPOND TO COMMENT*** While I understand the reply is mainly to manage reputation for people reading this review, I spent 35 minutes trying to 'rectify' the issue in the clinic and was met with eye rolls and sighs from unhelpful management. I understand there are protocols to follow in regards to billing, it is just a shame that this time it seems those protocols weren't adhered to and extra charges were added. I believe my email address and phone number are on file so I am happy to discuss further if you wish to reach out. ------ ORIGINAL POST Quoted €80-150 for a doctors consultation and after a 12 minute consultation was given a bill for €394,88. Was eventually discounted by €80 euros as was able to show I was charged for services I didn’t receive but still was grossly overcharged and my lack of speaking German was taken advantage of (one small example was my 12 minute consultation was charged as “Mind. 20mins” which the obnoxious manager tried to tell me means “under 20 minutes” and wouldn’t change). Even when you do the right thing and ask for a price upfront you still get ripped off. Please think twice before attending this clinic as they are not upfront at all and are very deceitful. The receptionist was good and very apologetic but all other staff dealt with were rude and unhelpful. The final explanation is “I’m sorry but the professor can charge what he wants and won’t change anything”. Be careful if you don’t speak German as you will likely get overcharged too.

Very kind and caring staff who took care of me when I was admitted with an ambulance in the middle of the night. Big respect!

Good services, but the emergency wasn't fast! Reception of emergency was so unfriendly, and rude!

Experience with this hospital could be described in two words - HORRENDOUS and UNPROFFESIONAL.. At the reception they lost my ID card. After two phone calls and one visit, the hospital reluctantly assured me that they didn't have it, which is why I couldn't fly back to my country and my flyticket was forfeited. After a few weeks, without notifying me by text/call/email (even though they had all my contact info) they sent me this ID card by post (after it had already been blocked).. The invoice that came home cost 190 € even though the hospital told me the price would be around 60 €. This whole situation was made worse by the unhelpful and unpleasant attitude of the staff. It had cost me lot of time and money and the hospital didn’t do anything to make up for the inconvieniences caused.

Awful. Patient Management is closed when it have to work. No response via phone to ask why you must pay specific amount of money and for which services. Huge respect for doctors, but management of clinic is awful and they deserve even less than 1 point out of 5.

After almost 30 hours, they still don’t know when they can perform surgery on my kidney stone. They only gave me 5 glasses of water! When I asked them about my situation and the plan, nobody answered! I’m thirsty, hungry, and in pain from the stone for more than 1 day. This is simply the worst hospital I have ever seen in my life!

Unfortunately but I have a pleasure to have surgery on pancreas cancer here. UK NHS said its noopetatable😬. The rooms 10 stars out of 5🙂, super clean, staff constantly checking on you, everything went smooth and pain free(thanks to epidural and painkillers). I have been sent home when I was ready, no complications and, 7 month out and good so far. Highly recommend, plus beautiful town which I was able to see before surgery.

I'm having an operation today and the preparation is taking place in a nursing room, what a disgrace 😡 Apparently there is no room available from ward 1 to 9.. I was forced to stay in the nursing room for 2 to 3 hours without a bed, no toilet, no wardrobe NOTHING.. either , or the operation has to be postponed, I was told.. 😡 The band that is attached to the hand itself was used by someone else and was attached to me. I only noticed it later 😡 I freaked out 😡

The maternity ward is one of the worst departments in this hospital. The patient is accompanied by many people and they sit for hours with the woman who gave birth to her child, as if they were staying in a hotel, without caring about the feelings and well-being of the other patient who is under their noise and suffers from annoying noises. The bad thing is, when you talk to some officials in this department, they tell you that people have the right to visit their patients. I tell them that people have the right to visit their patient, but not with the patient to live in the same room.

I had my baby there on the15.09.2022 and I will recommend this hospital to everyone. Lovely midwifes. Maximum care I received from all the workers. I wish I could give more than 5 stars

I had minimally invasive surgery and stayed 4 days. The nurses and doctors were all very friendly and helpful, the hospital and patient rooms were quiet, clean, and smelled fresh. I usually have a hard time sleeping in an unfamiliar place, but the hospital bed was surprisingly soft and comfortable and the nurses gave me something at night so I actually ended up getting the best sleep in years. Evening rounds came in at 10:30 PM and morning was 7:50 AM so my roommate and I got our 8-9 hours sleep and went home rested. Big thank you to all doctors and nurses at Albertinen Krankenhaus.

I was treated with high professionalism, and empathy @ the gynaecology department under the responsibility of Doctor Renana Schinker! I am happy to suggest her with confidence! As an expat living in Hamburg I felt @ this hospital less away from family and home! Thank you!

Came to Notaufnahme with racing heart, palpitations and chest pains with breathing issues. I wasnt sure whether it was serious enough considering how full the hospital was and i felt embarrassed to go. Nevertheless, i was treated warmly and respectfully during my long and expected wait (its an emergency room people, chances are someone is going to be sicker and more needing of help than you!) . The staff were under pressure with so many sick people and i was happy to wait. They found me room to stay overnight as the Cardiac Unit was full, and still i was treated respectfully and with dignity. I too am a foreigner, with questionable German skills but i try and found no racism as other have said. Im now in the cardiac ward and grateful that im being cared for. Still! Thankyou to lovely Notaufnahme Doctor, the Cardiac team, the nurses at 2A and also now up in 6B. Everyone has a sense of humour and are so friendly! I recommend this hospital 100% you are in good hands! Chill!

I was travelling from England on a motorcycle with friends to travel through the Pyrenees and the alps, it was the most beautiful sights I’ve ever seen then into the Black Forest, then I had a terrible accident and was smashed up badly, I was take by helicopter to university hospital where they repaired my broken bones, they saved my life, they were very good to me and I will never forget, I was in hospital there and back home for a couple of months, the end result I’ve led a near normal life, thanks to the surgeons who expertly repaired me, I will never forget,

i went for my yearly check but was told it cant be done if i do not have one of the 3Gs. i was told to get another appointment although the hospital websites states otherwise.

Every time I go there there is a different doctor. This time she spend most of the time typing away and looking at the computer. She was friendly but I got nowhere. For the past two years it's always the same. I have severe pain in my back and a few other parts but it's always a complete waist of time.

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good hospital, doctors and nurses are friendly

I got a brain surgery in 2017 and stayed for over a week here. I felt well treated, especially by the staff of international nurses and some doctors. I got some complications that I don't know whether they came from the care I got or if I dodged a bullet (6 hours surgery). Follow ups are a pain, emails don't work, phones only, and one has to wait for months for something.l, but the system is the bigger problem. I trust the professionals here, some will even talk English to you if asked. (Sure, don't come to the emergencies if you can be treated elsewhere). The facilities look a bit better than other hospitals in town.

the worst hospital I've been to. I broke my leg and they told me to go at 7 in the morning for the operation and they left me until 8 in the evening without giving me any information, without water. Then they remembered to come and inform me. The next time I was driving with my mother, who had a bypass and her blood pressure was quite high. The doctor asks me if he is dead? does someone have to die for us to go to the hospital? Because we also pay insurance for the doctors.

This is going to be a long story about my terrible experience in the emergency service. An ambulance brought me here at 21:30 with a broken swollen ankle. Since the emergency guy brought me inside and put me in a bed, no one came to me to do the first check-up. I begged 3 "nurses" to at least bring me ice because I am dying of pain. They go and never come back. They didnt give me ice, nor pain killers, they didn't even do a first check-up on me. How professional! especially when I can see them talking to each other, laughing, talking over the phone. The level of ignorance that I saw here is unimaginable. They are lucky that I was in pain otherwise I would have called the police. So around midnight finally someone came to do xray for me. half an hour later someone came to me to explain the severity of the injury, put the cast for me and gave me the crutches. Then he told me a nurse will come to explain everything, show me how to walk with the crutches, bring me outside with a wheelchair and call me a taxi. But no one showed up. I was screaming and no one heard me. At the end, around 02:30 I had to ask a "guest" for help. Luckily he was a nice guy unlike the nurses and stuff here. He helped me to walk outside and waited with me for a taxi that I called! I am waiting to fully recover and then I will see a lawyer about this. I even called them after days to send me the xray because the doctor wants to see them and they ignored my emails and phone calls. 5 hourse in the emergency with a broken ankel. No help, no check-up, no ice, no pain killers. No one helped me to leave and they didnt even call me a taxi!!

Worst criminal violators "working" there!! Stole one of my Organs also, when i was three years Young, and many litres of blood!! Other Details, you dont really wanna know 🤢🤢🤢🤮

Ok where do I start… first of all I don’t understand the negative comments here. The doctors are very good, excellent! They are so excited when they know our mother tongue is English and they want to talk English to us! We even had today two nurses, they asked if we can stick with English, since they never get the chance to talk in English! The nurses are just so nice and welcoming! We feel so good treated from the doctors and also from the nurses, generally all staff! You need to understand this is a VERY BUSY hospital, people are coming from many kilometers away to see a specialist here! If you don’t have anything severe, don’t keep this hospital busy. Since people like us travel miles in order to come to this Zentrum! We are very happy to be treated well. Just the organization feels sometimes kind of chaotic, probably is due to the busyness of this hospital. Thank you MHH for taking great care of us! Yes the architecture and rooms feel sometimes outdated, because this hospital was built like 60 yrs ago. But who cares about that, when the care is very good! Our comments are for two clinics: Hepatologie and also Viszeralchirurgie! Can only highly recommend it!

0 humanity,0 empathy. It’s not up to anyone to work in a hospital.some are juste heartless.

Was there at 10:30 PM . They registered quick , took blood and immediately send me to the concerned department. However had to wait 3 hrs before a dr finally addressed me . Really is this how they define emergency?

A tertiary hospital with a lot to offer, successful surgeries and high tech equipments. Problem is the people working in it. It puzzles me why some staff doctors and nurses are incompetent, arrogant, rude and unfriendly.

Disaster! Avoid coming here by all means. Hours and hours waiting when there are no other patients and you are being told just to wait a little bit more! Catastrophic, the worst ever!!!!!!

Accidentally my mother is sick,she is a 3 month visitor,I called 112 , the crew came very fast ,they were very kind, professionally treated my mom and they helped me with language when we reached the hospital , the nurse, receptionist,the Dr all give professional service ,with smile in their face,I stayed almost 8 hours, they were very busy ,they receive now and then emergency sick people.i just can say ,God bless you all the time ,God give you healthy life as you help a sick people under God will.thank you very much to all Ak clinic crew ,l💕💕💕💕

I was here two weeks ago as I cut my finger by accident. It was bleeding A LOT. Dripping onto the ER floor. Nobody cared until I had a panic attack. There was at least one good nurse with empathy. She was young and had black hair. Should have known her name.. The other middle aged nurse would mock me while passing, saying sth like she (obviously me) keeps crying and crying 😒 (with this face haha). I’m sure she thought I could not understand German only by looking at my appearance. Anyway I waited for like at least four hours there. Okay, yes, I was not obviously dying and I knew that, but at least I wish I had known what was going on and all. And the ER was not busy at all. Like four patients before me, I think. When I could finally get the x ray done, the woman in the x ray room was the WORST. My tendon was 100% cut so I could not move my finger. And yet, the incompetent woman tried to force my finger straighten up so hard and it gave me a lot worse pain than the one I had before going into the x ray room. Anyway, in the end I got transferred to St. Georg’s Asklepios and got surgery for re connecting my tendon after a long waiting time. I don’t think my nerves were connected properly as I cannot feel right side of my finger very well. I’m visiting a different hand surgeon at a different praxis. If this symptom persists, I’m getting the check up outside of Germany. Just like one review I have read here, I would rather just die (lol, with a bit of exaggeration) or fly to my home country with better health service if necessary. Even Cambodia had a better hospital, where I had to visit because of anaphylaxis during my travel there.

Very friendly staff overall. I came here to get my booster shot and I was at the wrong building, the security guy showed me where I needed to go. Then at the vaccination facility, the doctors were very helpful and informative.